If you’re like us, and just hearing the word ‘sprint’ is enough to break you out into a cold sweat, you’re not alone. Luckily today, we’re not talking about a physical sprint. Instead, we're unpacking the Google Design Sprint, which sounds about as energy-consuming as a running sprint, only more exciting and less painful. Our guests today, Stephen Meriwether and Kirsten Nordine, senior developer consultants at Stride, have taken part in Google Design Sprints, and are here to share the process with us. In this episode, we learn about the benefits of these Sprints. Typically, in the software development cycle, you will define what you’re going to work on, after which you’ll build it, and then finally, you’ll enter the validation phase.
Doing it this way means that you spend a great deal of time, money, and resources on the build stage, before actually being able to validate a product. So, the Google Design Sprint lets companies de-risk their product ideas and helps shorten the feedback loop to be able to fast-track product validation. While there’s no actual programming over the four days, it is still exciting for developers. Stephen and Kirsten set the stage for the Design Sprint, taking us through some of the necessities that you need to make it happen. They also walk us through the first day, Monday, and the various, structured activities included on this day. We see that the activities allow every member on the team to contribute, learn, and build that innovative muscle. This was a super fun episode, so be sure to tune in today!
Key Points From This Episode:
Transcript for Episode 152. Google Design Sprint and You - Part 1
[INTRODUCTION]
[0:00:01.9] MN: Hello and welcome to The Rabbit Hole, the definitive developer’s podcast, live from the boogie down Bronx. I’m your host, Michael Nunez. Our co-host today.
[0:00:10.0] DA: Dave Anderson.
[0:00:11.5] MN: Today, we’ll be talking about Google Design Sprint. What are they, why would anyone want to do it? I imagine, because Google made it, right Dave? I don’t know, I wouldn’t want to run this?
[0:00:23.3] DA: Yeah, all the cool kids are doing it I guess, right? Cool kids, Stephen Meriwether and Kirsten Nordine.
[0:00:28.5] MN: Hey, we got specials guest in the building. Live on here, it’s going down. How’s it going? Stephen, how’s it going? Kirsten, how are you?
[0:00:37.4] SM: Great.
[0:00:38.1] KN: Great, how are you?
[0:00:39.1] MN: I’m doing all right. Before we begin, Stephen, tell us a little bit about yourself and your experience with Google Design Sprint?
[0:00:45.5] SM: Sure. My name is Stephen, I am a senior developer consultant here at Stride, I’ve been working for Stride for about two years. And over the past few weeks, for the last few clients that I’ve been on, we’ve run Google Design Dprints and so I’ve learned a lot, they’re super fun and I’m really excited to talk about it.
[0:01:02.9] KN: I’m Kirsten, I’m a senior developer consultant at stride as well. Been at Stride for two, two and a half years now. And my previous engagement ran Google Design Sprint with Stephen Meriwether, it was super fun, learned a ton, excited to get into it.
[0:01:18.4] DA: Crushed it?
[0:01:20.5] MN: Dave, we got some experts here about to tell us about the Google Design Sprints, are you ready? I’m ready.
[0:01:27.0] DA: It sounds super cool. I love the idea of a design sprint, it’s way different than just a regular sprint. Like just writing the code sprint, right? How boring, why write code?
[0:01:39.2] MN: When you can design to sprint? There you go.
[0:01:41.4] DA: What is it exactly?
[0:01:44.0] SM: I think, before we say anything, I think it’s worth crediting this wonderful company named AJ&Smart. They’re a company based out of Germany. They have some awesome materials that will be referenced later on in the conversation. But a lot of the stuff that we’re going to say, we learned from them. I just want to preface the conversation with that.
[0:02:05.1] DA: Do they continue the tradition of like a Google Design Sprint or like refine it further?
[0:02:10.3] SM: Yeah, we’ll definitely get into that. To answer your original question. What does a Google Design Sprint? A design sprint is a four-day process for rapidly solving big challenges, creating new products and improving existing ones. And the primary selling point is that it compresses what could potentially be months of work into just a couple of days.
[0:02:32.0] MN: That’s a lot of time.
[0:02:33.8] SM: Yeah.
[0:02:35.1] MN: Awesome, how did this become a thing? I mean, I imagine like people may have been running some sort of design sprint step, where taking months of work like the individuals you mentioned before were able to condense this down to a couple of days. What’s the history of it?
[0:02:55.5] SM: The Google Design Sprint was developed by this guy named Jake Knapp. He was a long time Google employee. And he realized that typically, in the software development cycle, you define what you’re going to work on and then you build it and then you validate whether the thing was successful or not.
And what ends up happening in a lot of projects is, the build stage takes more and more time. And so, you actually spend a lot of time and money and resources building product before you actually validate whether or not it was successful. He had this idea of tightening that feedback loop and so he developed this system which is now the Google Design Sprint. He is the Google Design Sprint because he developed it while he was working for Google.
He ran this framework of a bunch of exercises with various different teams inside of Google. He eventually became a design partner at Google Ventures where the concept was formalized and Google Ventures has been running it for all their clients ever since and it’s sort of a staple in the way they work.
[0:04:02.3] MN: This has been like you mentioned in 2010, it’s been 10 years of the creation of this and constantly being refined and different ways of it running. They have multiple versions of this I imagine now since it’s been out for 10 years?
[0:04:18.1] DA: That’s kind of interesting, kind of talk to me like that feedback loop for validation. And I guess like kind of imagining like kind of like completely rowing in the wrong direction and then having to go back the way you came and row the other direction so that you can get yourself in the right place where your product needs to be.
[0:04:38.6] MN: Yeah, totally. What the Google Design Sprint is, fundamentally it’s a series of exercises that you run over five days, that allow you to ideate, build and then validate business challenges or objectives.
That was the process that Jake Knapp developed with Google, that’s what Google Ventures used for a long time. And then this company that we mentioned before, AJ&Smart saw this thing that Google, was doing was super excited about it and started writing their own designs sprints for their clients.
Hundreds of design sprints later, they realized that you can actually condense the five days into four days and it take Friday off.
[0:05:18.5] DA: Just party.
[0:05:19.6] SM: Just literally party.
[0:05:21.6] KN: Kind of.
[0:05:22.7] SM: Google Design Sprint. I think you actually party that the last day. I think that’s part of the official documentation. The Google Design Sprint 2.0 was developed by both AJ&Smart and Jake Knapp. That’s now the process that we use at Stride and that’s the recommended process that you would use if you want to run a Google Design Sprint.
[0:05:49.1] DA: You mentioned that this design sprint like helps you tighten the feedback loop and get quicker information about the product ideas that you have. What other problems might you solve with the Design Sprint besides just like validating the ideas?
[0:06:08.2] KN: I think one of the things that helps with this that innovation on teams. It’s hard for teams to innovate, come up with new ideas and there’s a lot of structure built into the Design Sprint itself to facilitate that that kind of thinking.
[0:06:22.2] DA: Kind of brain storming.
[0:06:24.7] KN: Totally, like a lot of structure and different techniques to get everybody in that headspace.
[0:06:31.0] DA: Cool.
[0:06:32.7] SM: Yeah, what I would add to that is a lot of times you see at product companies, they have big business challenges or objectives that they need to hit. And you have someone in the organization coming up with product ideas to solve those things but how do you know if they actually work? Well, you build software and then you look at the results after the fact and if it worked, great, if not, you try again.
The problem with that process is that building software is really expensive and it takes a lot of time. What if you could do something where you have some process that lets you validate this like product idea that you have in a short amount of time before writing any software?
And so, fundamentally, it lets you de-risk your product ideas. You can use that at any type of company, anywhere there’s a big product idea. Probably not as granular as like moving this button five pixels to the left. But if you have a big product ideas that are going to take lots of time to build out, you can use a design sprint to validate the efficacy of that idea before you involve software engineers.
[0:07:40.5] DA: Like traditionally, software engineers might not be part of the design sprint, it’s more kind of like a business and design and customer focused like who is participating in this. Or what kind of people would normally attend the Design Sprint?
[0:07:54.1] KN: I think it’s a whole cross functional team that can attend. Software developers can be involved, people on the design or product side. You definitely want domain experts and stake holders in the room.
[0:08:07.2] SM: Yeah, to add to that, I think it’s important, that it is a cross functional team because a client might want this – a product that is a little unrealistic. And so, who is going to tell them that the scope is actually 15 years’ worth of work if not a software developer?
[0:08:25.7] DA: Just wanted to have that traveling salesman and solves in linear time. It sounds like a lot of the techniques that you’re talking about like ideating and like validating those ideas, sound like they’re very useful in like a project inception. Are there any other times that might be useful to start Google Design Sprint?
[0:08:51.5] SM: Yeah, Dave. I think you’re right. A project inception makes a lot of sense. And at Stride, we’ve actually run these Google Design Sprints at business inceptions. So, people come to us with ideas and they want us to build out their product and we use the Google Design Sprint to help them align on exactly what they want to do and then start validating some of their ideas before we write any software.
[0:09:16.2] MN: While there’s software engineers in the room, there may not be programming that’s actually being done at the moment but having those people in the room can tell whether it’s going to take X amount of time to tell the business folks to pump the breaks on certain features I imagine?
[0:09:34.4] SM: Exactly, yeah. There’s actually no programming done in the five-day design sprint, that doesn’t mean that it’s not super exciting and super fun for a programmer in those conversations.
[0:09:48.4] DA: Cool. I think we covered like most of the who, what, why, we just have like a, wear that I guess haven’t really answered like – where do you normally try and do these design sprints like –
[0:10:06.3] KN: I think somewhat kind of office space works well, but you want to make sure that you have like space for people to move around wall space, natural light, you’re going to be in a room with a bunch of people for four pretty long days. So, you want it to be comfortable, have snacks, windows fresh air, all these things if we don’t always have in New York City.
[0:10:29.6] SM: AJ&Smart, who I mentioned has done a ton of these Google Design Sprints, they actually have branded slippers that they hand out to their clients when they come in to run Design Sprints.
[0:10:39.5] MN: No, like Crocs?
[0:10:41.1] SM: yeah.
[0:10:42.6] MN: Snap, they got Crocs, the Google Design Sprint. I imagine, they’re standing so often and then having them move around and all that stuff.
[0:10:49.8] SM: Yeah, it’s all about being comfortable. You’re in a room with the same people for a long time, the more comfortable you are, the more creative you can be.
[0:10:57.3] KN: Totally.
[0:10:58.5] MN: IE crocs.
[0:11:00.0] DA: Is there like friction that you feel like being in the same room with somebody for so long? Is there like a confrontational aspect to it where you have to prove that your idea’s better or -
[0:11:13.0] SM: You know, we’re going to get into that nuts and bolts of the Design Sprint but every design sprint needs to have what we call a decider. It’s someone who has the ultimate decision-making power. And so yeah, sometimes you get a little bit of trying to sway to the decider one way or the other but having one person who makes most of the decisions I think helps remove a lot of that.
[0:11:35.5] DA: Okay, cool.
[0:11:37.5] MN: That’s something I need to incorporate in my life. We need to assign a decider and then have that person be responsible for all the decisions that I made. That’s my wife. That’s how my wife works. My wife is the decider.
[0:11:50.5] KN: Having a decider is awesome. I think everyone’s probably had the experience of being in big meetings and trying to come to a consensus with like seven to 10 people, having somebody who is responsible for making the decision is a real advantage.
[0:12:04.6] DA: That’s like a meme from like early 2000s SNL, right? I am the decider.
[0:12:12.0] MN: There you go.
[0:12:13.6] DA: I guess they make a can knuckle. It’s official title. It’s not silly. It’s real.
[0:12:20.7] SM: They get the bigger dot.
[0:12:25.1] KN: It’s true, the decider – there are exercises where people dot vote, they vote on ideas that they like by putting small dots but the decider gets a really big dot.
[0:12:35.1] DA: Is it like comically large?
[0:12:37.9] KN: It’s not comically large, I think it would be good to introduce one that was comically large. I think it should be bigger.
[0:12:47.8] DA: They could like have in their back pocket if they’re really deciding pretty hard.
[0:12:52.8] MN: If I’m ever the decider, I will have a comical large dot vote.
[0:12:55.8] SM: We have definitely searched the Internet for comically large stickie’s.
[0:13:05.5] MN: We mentioned before that it has been condensed from five days to four days to run this? I want to get into an exercise where we explain the four days being Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. We all know Friday is for partying. But let’s start with Monday. Monday, 9:00, we all show up to this office, it has a lot of natural light, and a lot of space. I got my Crocs. I got my Crocs and ready to go. What is the day look like for Monday?
[0:13:36.5] SM: Bobby, I actually want to take one step back and say, let’s like set the stage a little bit for Design Sprint. What are some thing you need? You need about 500 stickies per person because it’s a stickie heavy exercise. You need Sharpies. You definitely need Crocs, you – Kirsten, what else do you need?
[0:13:56.7] KN: You need a lot of dots. You need snacks, water. You also – it’s nice to have a dry erase board. Big like easel stickies. It’s also great to have a way to play music. There’s a lot of times where people are kind of working quietly individually so having a soundtrack you can play as background music is helpful.
[0:14:20.1] SM: Yeah, one of the core principles of the Google Design Sprint is concept of working together alone. What they found is having a lot of people in the room, brainstorming out loud and usually, what ends up happening is the loudest person wins, right? The way you get around doing that is we’re on a room together, but a lot of the times, we are working independently by ourselves for a set amount of time. And then once the time is over, you present to the group one by one and then the decider makes the decision.
That prevents this like loudest person wins problem. But you also get into some awkward silence. Some music helps break that.
[0:15:00.4] DA: That’s cool. I like that so that gives the introverts a chance to shine.
[0:15:05.1] SM: Yeah, exactly.
So, Friday evening, what you do is you send an email to everyone who is going to be a part of the Design Sprint and you give them an outline of what the next week looks like. And so, it is four days, every day is a super long day but we recommend starting at 10 AM and then ending at 5 PM. And then having a one-hour lunch in between and a few breaks. You get through a lot, you are in a room with everyone, with a bunch of people and so it can be really draining.
So, you set the stage on Friday, you make sure you have all of your materials and then you show up at Monday morning at 10 AM.
[0:15:45.1] DA: All right so now you are in your Crocs.
[0:15:47.1] MN: Yes, so now you are in your crocs, now we’re back, crocs, comfy, snacks, music, there is stickies, dots, Sharpies. 10 AM, Monday morning, what is the beginning of the process of that Monday?
[0:16:02.3] KN: Well, you got to kick it off and I think every day it is really important to get people a sense for exactly what they are going to be through throughout the day. But the first Design Sprint activity that happens is called the expert interview. So you have some experts in the room, who know a lot about the business and the whole team does this collaborative notetaking activity where they interview that expert and write down questions that they think of or challenges that they think of in terms of these raising them as like, “How might we do blank?”
[0:16:32.7] DA: Is like someone that might be close to the team or like Dave interaction with in the past or do you try and bring in some outside perspective for the expert?
[0:16:45.5] SM: It can be all of the above. So, it can be someone who is on the team who is subject matter expert, it could be someone in the organization or it could be someone else outside of the organization.
[0:16:55.2] DA: Okay, so maybe a contact sharing exercise or inevitably a contact sharing exercise but like yeah, just coming from someone who is trusted.
[0:17:05.5] KN: Definitely. And the whole team could ask questions and then from there you move onto establishing some long-term goals, which is a very optimistic look at what might the product do in two years’ time? And this is supposed to be super optimistic, best case scenario and then you actually right after that move on to something called sprint questions, which are like very pessimistic questions that you can ask about that goal. It is meant to get at what are all the things that might prevent us from achieving this?
[0:17:35.7] SM: Yeah and then using your “how might wes,” your long-term goal and your sprint questions, the next step is actually doing what’s called thought voting, which we referenced earlier and so the team, you put the stickies, the “how might we” stickies on the board and you put the sprint questions on the board and the team – well, you give everyone some dots and they vote on the ones that they think are most impactful.
The “which, how might we” questions need to be answered out of all of them? Which sprint questions are the most risky that we need to answer? And so, we spend time going through as a team actually dot voting on them. And then the facilitator, whoever that ends being on the team will go through and read which of the “how might we’s” and which are the sprint questions have the most dots. And those sort of anchor the rest of the conversation and the rest of the week.
[0:18:24.9] DA: Okay, cool. Do you throw away any of the ones that nobody voted for or do you hoard all of some knowledge and questions and thoughts that people have?
[0:18:35.0] KN: We took pictures of all of it. We didn’t save everything but it was nice to have things up as a reference.
[0:18:41.2] SM: I have a drawer next to my office that has stickies from 1995 so –
[0:18:46.4] MN: Oh.
[0:18:47.6] SM: I have picked up.
[0:18:49.1] DA: So, everyone’s stickies are in your drawer.
[0:18:53.7] KN: I think you wanted to keep the stickies but we didn’t.
[0:18:57.9] MN: So, note to those, note to people save the stickies it’s important.
[0:19:02.7] DA: Whichever Stephen, he is going to take your stickies.
[0:19:06.2] KN: It is very well documented.
[0:19:10.6] SM: So, the purpose of doing these expert interviews and doing these long-term goal settings and these sprint questions is trying to identify what it is that your product might do? And so, the next exercise is this thing called the map. And so, the map is a very high level overview of what your product is doing and so there is a way you go about doing this.
On the left side, you have your actors, your users, your businesses, whatever your actors are. On the right side you have your objectives or goals and so you have users on the left side, objectives on the right side and you try to build out a journey to go from user to goal.
And there is a few helpful ways you can do that. You can talk about how users or your actors would be first learned about your product and so they go from an actor to discovering you, learning about you. And then they move to how they actually use your product. And then by using your product they accomplish whatever goal they are trying to achieve.
So, what we typically do is we go to a white board, we, pretty far apart write actors on the left side and then you give yourself some space and then you write learn and then you give yourself some more space and you write use. And then you give yourself a little bit more space and you write goals. And the team collaboratively figures out how a user or an actor goes from never hearing about you to accomplishing their goal using your product.
And so, that exercise is called the map and it is a collaborative exercise we do together.
[0:20:48.4] DA: And so those goals are different from the ones from the previous step in general>
[0:20:53.6] SM: Yeah, so the long-term goal is more business focused. It is like, “I want feature XYZ or product XYZ to increase conversion by 150% or something.” And the goals in the map are what are the users actually trying to do? They are trying to purchase life insurance or they are trying to buy stock. So those are more user focused during the mapping exercise and the long-term goal is more business-focused.
So, you build out this map on a big white board, who your actors are. How did they first learn about you, how do they use your product and what goals they’re trying to achieve? and then you take your sprint questions and your “how might we’s” and you put them on the map. So, one of your sprint questions might be, how do we know that someone needs life insurance or something. And so, you would take those sprint question and you would put them over on the discover side of the map because that involves more about them learning about your product.
And so you take already how might we use your sprint questions, you overlay them on top of the map and at the end, you have a pretty decent understanding of your product and how it actually achieves user goals and how it might be beneficial to a user.
And the whole purpose here is this usually lives in someone’s head. But it is about getting it out of their head onto the white board to get some shared context and to also put in some new ideas that that person might not be thinking about.
You go from having doing this collaborative mapping exercise that is still super high-level, right? We are not drawing anything yet, it is only words on a whiteboard. And so, the next step is taking those words and high-level concepts and making them a bit more concrete. And so, there is a couple of exercises that we run to turn feature ideas into actual more concrete product and I will let Kirsten to talk about this.
[0:22:52.5] KN: Sure. So, the first one is something called lightning demos where everybody on the team goes off, does a little bit of research, find some existing product that solves a similar problem in some way. It doesn’t have to be in the same industry as the product you are talking about the idea is to kind of get some ideas on the table, inspire the whole team with a bunch of solutions that have already been out built.
So, everyone researches that. Everyone then does a quick presentation of the idea that they have discovered. And then from there you move onto sketching some concepts. And there is a few like sort of ways of sketching the build on each other. The first one is you just walk around the room taking notes writing out some of the ideas that you have already been discussed, sometimes that is just rewording things that have already been said then you –
[0:23:52.5] DA: That is like a structured exercise actually, right? Now, it’s notes time, okay
[0:23:56.4] KN: So, like notes, you just write ideas. And one of the things about this that I like so much is that you don’t have to have an idea yet. You can be restating things that have already been said.
I think one of the other kind of principles of the Design Sprint is that you don’t have to rely on creativity. So just building up that ability to come up with ideas slowly with a few steps. So, note taking and then you move onto a doodling exercise. These are all timed.
And then there is the best exercise of just called crazy eights. Where you actually fold the piece of paper up into eight tiny sections and you get one minute to draw one idea. You do that eight times really rapidly. It is super uncomfortable. It is a little bit stressful. Some of the drawings are like utter trash but you work through it and get over that, which is nice. And then the last thing that you do is you draw this more fully formed idea and even if you don’t have an idea that you feel really good about yet, you probably have something percolating at this point. So, you do a more fleshed out drawing of a concept that you think might work.
[0:25:12.4] SM: And the goal of that, the concept sketching and these exercises that Kristen just talked about is transforming product ideas into actual sketches. And so, as she mentioned they build on each other because it is really hard to go from, “I want to do XYZ to this is how it might look like on a webpage or a mobile app or anything like that.”
And so, you slowly build up the muscle of thinking about how this might look. You do crazy eights, which I agree is the most fun exercise of the whole thing. You start drawing over and over again and this process takes an entire afternoon to do these four exercises. And at the end, you have some real sketches of how you might solve this problem in a real way.
[0:26:00.1] DA: So, when I’m eating lunch again? Is it actually – I am only joking but I guess they sounded like they were just fun little things that we’re doing at the end of the day like “Oh it is like 10 minutes and then we’d do some doodling,” but I mean this sounds like actually it is a big bulk of the day.
[0:26:20.4] KN: We left out a pretty important part, which is lunch break.
[0:26:24.2] MN: Yes, what’s your lunch?
[0:26:28.5] SM: We have to fast while we do Google Design Sprint.
[0:26:30.4] DA: Oh, it’s keto. Oh man everybody is doing keto.
[0:26:34.0] MN: You got it yeah.
[0:26:35.1] SM: So, the way the day is broken up is you have expert interviews in the morning, right after that you do long-term goal and sprint questions. And then you turn that shared knowledge into a map of what a user journey might be and that is a good breaking point. And so, you stop there, you take about an hour for lunch and then you come back and you focus the rest of the afternoon on turning that map into sketches.
[0:27:01.8] DA: Cool, okay.
[0:27:03.2] MN: That sounded like an intense Monday. I am already exhausted from hearing all the – it just sounds exhausting.
[0:27:11.3] DA: It’s a lot of stuff.
[0:27:12.9] KN: It is exhausting. It is really fun. But it is really tiring and you have to take a lot of breaks.
[0:27:18.8] MN: I see.
[0:27:20.0] DA: Although some of these sound like party games. I feel like you just do this at a party like just play crazy eights, why not?
[0:27:27.7] MN: No.
[0:27:28.8] DA: No, okay we are not going to game this big thing.
[0:27:32.5] MN: Yeah that is wild, draw eight one-minute sketches and things? I can barely draw so to actually draw something in a tiny square for a minute that does sound pretty stressful.
[0:27:42.9] DA: I love tiny drawings. That’s my jam.
[0:27:45.1] SM: With that being said, the exercises are timed in a way such that the day ends at 5 PM. So, you have a long evening to recover and get back for day two.
[0:27:56.1] MN: Awesome. All right well after an extensive Monday that we just went through it is Tuesday 10 AM, got my Crocs on, got some snacks, music is playing, 10 AM what’s up?
[0:28:08.4] DA: Yeah, what is the music that is playing actually? What song is playing? I need to be set in the situation?
[0:28:15.4] MN: Yeah what music did any of you play? I am curious like was it classical, was it hard heavy metal?
[0:28:22.8] KN: Only heavy metal. No, we didn’t.
[0:28:24.4] MN: Oh, heavy metal. Oh yeah.
[0:28:29.6] KN: Tried to find background music that didn’t have a lot of lyrics that was just sort of on to make the room not silent. And I think AJ&Smart actually has a great playlist on Spotify that they use for the Google Design Sprint.
[0:28:45.0] DA: Oh yeah. Got to link that one.
[0:28:47.7] MN: Yeah and every corner they try to optimize for this.
So that was Monday from what we just heard about the Google Design Sprint. And we are going to have to hold off here because there is a lot of content coming in store afterwards.
[0:29:01.0] DA: What a ride. The Google Design Sprint is no joke. There is so much activities, fun times, lots of heavy metal from my understanding and Crocs.
[0:29:15.3] MN: Yeah Crocs and a good playlist, you’re in a room hashing it out with your coworkers. Lunch is important. You want to make sure it’s fast and speedy.
[0:29:22.6] DA: We’ll definitely include some good links to different resources in the shownotes.
[0:29:27.3] MN: Be ready next week, we will talk about the Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday of the Design Sprint because everybody knows Friday is for partying.
[0:29:35.3] DA: That’s true, yeah.
[END OF INTERVIEW]
[0:29:39.9] MN: Follow us now on Twitter @radiofreerabbit so we can keep the conversation going. Like what you hear? Give us a five-star review and help developers like you find their way into The Rabbit Hole and never miss an episode, subscribe now however you listen to your favorite podcast. On behalf of our producer extraordinaire, William Jeffries and my amazing co-host, Dave Anderson and me, your host, Michael Nunez, thanks for listening to The Rabbit Hole.
[END]
Links and Resources:
Stephen Meriwether on LinkedIn
AJ&Smart Design Sprint Playlist
